What Oil do you use in your Auto?

[hennasxi]

Hi there, I'm new on here having just acquired a Jap spec 1999 Spi/Mpi hybrid with and Auto box, and it needs an oil change.  This car is unusual for a late Jap spec Mini as it has lived in the UK all its life and will remain here too now I own it !!  It had a recent oil change after needing a new head gasket and re-skim of the head as it was overheating when I bought it.   Since the oil change, after a couple of hundred miles it has developed with weird issue where when you select forward from reverse or vice-versa, the oil light comes on for a second or two, then goes out.  Only does it when changing direction Forward-reverse or vice versa not when in Drive and stopping with your foot on the brake at 700rpm or whatever it sits at like that, so it seems to be a pressure change when selecting a gear direction change only.
First thing I plan to do is change the oil - not sure what was put in it last time as I didn't do the work (will find out), but being in the UK, are we saying 10W40 MA2 motorcycle oil is the way to go here too with our not so hot climate?  Car has done less that 30000 miles.   Thanks to all for participating with this forum, I'd be lost without it having just got my first auto mini !!  Cheers, Andy

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

Hi Andy,

Also fit a new o ring under the bolt head / washer of the filter canister as they go hard and then people over tighten the canister which damages them beyond use.

sounds like your issue is low oil, can you let us know what procedure you are using to check the oil level ?

[hennasxi]

Hi Martin,  I think perhaps that might be what I am doing wrong having now read some threads on here!  I have just been checking the level before starting it up, like I tend to do with all my other cars, but from what I am reading on here I need to run the engine for a minute or two and then check it ?  Maybe it is just low oil then?  It needs another change anyhow as that was the advise from the engine work, so is the MA2 oil mentioned in this thread the stuff to go for?

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

The correct method is to warm your engine then stop it, time for 60 seconds then dip it.

[hennasxi]

OK will give that a try this week and see what results I get.   I think I'm going to order some of that Motul 10W-40 MA2 spec oil and see how I get on with that too.  Cheers

[richard1]

As Martin says, you need to get the oil into the converter and places it drains from (including possibly the filter). The light is showing low oil pressure, which should not be from wear in that time. When the oil gets low, if you had an oil pressure gauge it would be jumping from 0 to 90 as it tries to compress oil, then air, then oil again.

In regular cars with automatics, you check the transmission oil with the car running and motor oil after running and stopping for a minute or ten (shouldn't really be done the next day, as sometimes filters drain back), in Mini's its after a minute or two stopped.

[hennasxi]

You can tell I know little about Autos!!  Thanks for the advise, I'll do that this evening and let you know how I get on.  If its just low oil that will be great news, and it sounds like that is probably all it is.   The car was given a good work out with a 200 mile motorway trip, and that was only about 100 miles after an oil change, so it may just be its used a bit on the long run.

Cheers,
Andy

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

The most common issue I find is low oil, I have fixed AP units over the years that had nothing wrong with them because I suspect low oil, especially when they phone up and say they have the same issues....

Changing oil is a great thing to do, keep it as clean and more importantly moisture free (low mileage autos suffer from moisture in the oil) but using the correct methods is something that a lot of people apparently know how to do and I have been shouted at for "trying to tell my grandma how to suck eggs) on many occasion by so called experts...

I try to show people the light and with this website and the help of others on here the knowledge base is gaining ground

[hennasxi]

Found out today that 20W50 was put in at the last oil change 300 miles ago.   Sounds like 10W40 MA2 spec is a better option?  I think because its a mini they put 20W50 in, which is normally the right thing to do, but maybe not with this gearbox?

I plan to order some of that Motul 5000 stuff and use that on oil change as it seems to be the better stuff to use.

Not yet measured the oil - too wet last night to bother, will try it tonight instead :-)

[mra-minis]

Sept 20, 2016 16:06:29 GMT hennasxi said:

Found out today that 20W50 was put in at the last oil change 300 miles ago.   Sounds like 10W40 MA2 spec is a better option?  I think because its a mini they put 20W50 in, which is normally the right thing to do, but maybe not with this gearbox?

I plan to order some of that Motul 5000 stuff and use that on oil change as it seems to be the better stuff to use.

Not yet measured the oil - too wet last night to bother, will try it tonight instead :-)

20W50 hasn't been the correct oil since the late 70's when Rover with the help of Ricardo and bic something or other.... found that 10W40 reduced frictional losses whilst making no difference on wear within the engine or transmission, even the performance companies will specify 10W40, fitting 20W50 is just a load of nonsense.

[hennasxi]

OK, so I followed the oil measuring procedure and found the oil level to be at the minimum end on the dipstick, but not below minimum.   Topped oil up and repeated procedure, and its now just above the max mark.   Problem with the oil light coming on when going from park to R or R to 1 or 1 to R is still present, no change.

Will try an oil change to 10w40 and see if that cures it next.

[mra-minis]

Sept 20, 2016 20:29:32 GMT hennasxi said:

OK, so I followed the oil measuring procedure and found the oil level to be at the minimum end on the dipstick, but not below minimum.   Topped oil up and repeated procedure, and its now just above the max mark.   Problem with the oil light coming on when going from park to R or R to 1 or 1 to R is still present, no change.

Will try an oil change to 10w40 and see if that cures it next.


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A pressure check is required, you may have a few issues that are only small by themselves but conspire to cause the light to come on momentarily, or you could simply have a knackered engine.

Does it engage all gears ok ?

Try removing the pressure release valve in the front of the block and cleaning it.

[hennasxi]

Thought I'd post an update.   I've completed another oil and filter change putting 10W40 in, but the issue with the oil light flashing on continues.   Changed the oil pressure sensor, but that made no difference.   Oil pressure check and pressure release valve still to check out.  Car is still changing gear without issues, oil light never on when actually moving, only when stationary and first selecting a gear from N or P.   Will keep plugging away at it !!

[limby2000]

Yeah, think your next port of call should be to change the spring and plunger in the pressure relief valve, their not expensive and are easy to change (about 15 pound). They control the idle oil pressure. Peace of mind whilst eliminating another suspect.

[hennasxi]

Looks like the starter motor has to come off to get to it?

[69hcode]

Maybe the wire to the sender is just grounding.

[notamini]

With both my Americas, I found that the ignition, plugs, etc need to be top notch. As soon as the HP drops due to bad ignition the light comes on. It just happened to me this past week. Idle felt like the engine was struggling and light was starting to glow. I blasted the plugs and now pep is up and light is out. That's with 40ish Lbs on the oil gauge before cleaning.

Mark

[hennasxi]

Oct 19, 2016 21:30:54 GMT limby2000 said:

Yeah, think your next port of call should be to change the spring and plunger in the pressure relief valve, their not expensive and are easy to change (about 15 pound). They control the idle oil pressure. Peace of mind whilst eliminating another suspect.

OK so I have done an oil pressure check now and at idle it is about 65psi.   When I select a gear it drops to 10 (R) or 20 (1,2,3 or D) for a second or two, then back to 55-60psi.

I guess this could still be the pressure relief valve, but if that were stuck open, would the pressure not be low at idle ?  I think 65psi is about right??

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

I think you maybe confused, it looks like you are checking the ENGINE oil pressure and you need to check the automatic pressure at the filter head as a minimum.... Reverse should give you 160psi plus

[mra-minis]

Oct 20, 2016 12:36:04 GMT notamini said:

With both my Americas, I found that the ignition, plugs, etc need to be top notch. As soon as the HP drops due to bad ignition the light comes on. It just happened to me this past week. Idle felt like the engine was struggling and light was starting to glow. I blasted the plugs and now pep is up and light is out. That's with 40ish Lbs on the oil gauge before cleaning.

Mark

Mark I suspect you have retarded ignition, this can be a simple adjustment or a completely different advance curve... if the engine is modified (this can be a simple thing like the air filter, etc etc...) in any way from the vehicles standard build even another standard engine from a different car can require a different timing advance curve.

[hennasxi]

Oct 29, 2016 15:56:56 GMT mra-minis said:

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

I think you maybe confused, it looks like you are checking the ENGINE oil pressure and you need to check the automatic pressure at the filter head as a minimum.... Reverse should give you 160psi plus

I wanted to check what pressure I was getting at the sensor to see what is going on with the engine pressure as that is what is being measured by the pressure switch / oil light.

Not sure the pressure kit I have will let me attach it to the filter head ?  What do you need to check the pressure at the filter head ?

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

Oh yes.... I think it's me that's confused

Ok the one thing that most people are not aware of is that the oil light will come on if the engine has retarded ignition ...

What can cause retarded ignition...

1) incorrectly set ignition
2) incorrect advance curve (wrong or damaged distributor)
3) fault in drive system to distributor
4) fault within distributor
5) elevated amount of wear in timing system

If you do want to test the transmission pressure I have a gauge kit that I add a couple of items to allow the correct fitment to the AP2 unit.

[limby2000]

Hi Martin, why would retarded ignition cause the light to come on?, is it reduced rpm at idle?.

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

Retarded ignition (for those that don't know) is when the piston has compressed the air/fuel mixture and is on the way down past optimal ignition point, so the mixture is expanding and then suddenly the flame front is moving at supersonic speeds towards the piston crown, this has the effects of A) introducing more shock loads into the big-end and main bearings and more heat into the engine, the effect is that the oil takes a massive battering and thus is A) at minimum viscosity and B) being pressurised out of the bearings by the force acting on the piston, these two issues alone can cause the oil pressure to drop, however when combined they cause it to drop to the point where the warning lamp can come on.... over the years of taking loads of Minis to rolling road sessions I have witnessed gauge pressures of 15 to 25psi (some lamps come on at a higher pressure) once calibration starts to correct the ignition timing the pressure climbs up to a more normal level.

Fitting the correct distributor advance curve for your engine is crucial, but fitting an ECU that can be calibrated has so many benefits that the difference is truly amazing

[notamini]

So Martin, in order to get the correct advance curve on a standard build (straight from factory) one must make certain the distributor is working well and also the vacuum line and pot? I don't see how else it could be adjusted. I have set the timing to 8 deg. at 1000 rpm no vac. This is recommended by Todd, the guru of Austin Americas. I have replaced the points with Pertronics electronic ignition. First thing I noticed was the dwell changed dramatically. So did my mileage from 50mpg hwy to about 38mpg. Plugs lately are a wee bit black. They used to come up sort of sand coloured.

Mark

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

Your assumption about the standard engine with the standard distributor is technically correct, the problem is that subtle modifications to the engine and fuel will require a different advance curve, so if you have a standard engine with the advance curve as prescribed by Austin then you should be fairly close, most dizzies have the part number stamped in to the body so this can be checked, so long as the internals haven't been modified at all, you may also find that you have wear in the drive system to the distributor thus causing a potential dwell error

The electronic ignition will help reduce the dwell but not eliminate it entirely (even in a new system there is an element of ignition dwell...

How is Mr Miller ? I haven't spoken with him for at least 6 years I think

Black as in , sooty plugs are often caused by weak spark, low compression... in your case I would say your module is not working as well as it should do

Just a thought is your car POS or NEG earth ? check your kit is correct for your car / distributor.

Martin

[notamini]

Thanks for the response, Martin.
All components are virgin and original to the car. The module was ordered as Pos earth with resistor and I confirmed it when I got it. The coil is new and it uses the resistor. Wires are original but they are not carbon fibre. Fibre ones are junk. So wires are not a problem. Dizzy is clean and no metal bits inside. Advance vacuum appears to be working but I do not have the equipment to test.

Todd is so busy that he will only answer the phone to someone that has prearranged a call and is willing to pay him his time. Emails are about the only way to contact him. He told me he was spending more time on new projects. I think it is Mercedes cars.

Mark

[mra-minis]

I can be contacted on [e-mail]

Oil light and black smoke.... does sound retarded to me, try advancing it a touch, don't forget that points will possibly have a different firing point to electronic ignition

[notamini]

Don't see smoke but the tail pipe shows black. I just figured it was from warming up with the choke on. Maybe that's all it is with the plugs too. Still, I'd like to return my mileage to 45+ mpg.

[69hcode]

My stock dizzy was advancing too much at idle. The springs are too weak. Unhook your vacuum line and watch the timing and see how much it advances while you increase the rpm. Mine was  only advancing 14 degrees. Took me a while to figure it out. I now have a 123 electronic distributor.  Still trying to figure out the right curve since I have a stage one kit on my 998. I also live above 5,000 feet.

Any tips on timing at high elevation Martin?